A couple of weeks ago, Megan taught me about McGuffins. I also recently learned about Mary Sues.
According to Wikipedia, Mary Sue “is a pejorative term for a fictional character who is portrayed in an overly idealized way and lacks noteworthy flaws, or has unreasonably romanticized flaws. Characters labeled Mary Sues, as well as the stories they appear in, are generally seen as wish-fulfillment fantasies of the author.” (More at Wikipedia. )
The term originated in the Star Trek fan fiction community but I think romance novelists, too, often skate a fine line with Mary Sues.
Consider these characteristics of a Mary Sue (or Gary Stu).
“The typical Mary Sue is always physically attractive, and her appearance may include an unusual but natural hair or eye color. Eye colour may also be depicted as changing according to time, place, emotion, or other causes. Mary Sue’s name often has a special meaning, and if so, either she or the author will inform the cast or reader of it.”
“Mary Sue is beautiful, so Gary Stu is handsome.”
“Tragic backgrounds are also common among Mary Sues, and frequently include family abuse or neglect.”
“While Mary Sue is often bright and cheerful no matter what her past has dealt her, Gary Stu tends to be brooding and frequently violent.”
Dangerous territory for a romance author! Most of us try to depict our characters as attractive (though not always perfect) and to give them some serious problems to tackle. So when does a character become a Mary Sue?
I decided to put the heroine of my current mess-in-progress through The Original Fiction Mary-Sue Litmus Test.
Imagine my relief when she scored a mere 19 points, in the 11-20 “Non-Sue” range. 🙂
Then I decided to give the test a whirl with the heroine of Barbara Cartland’s HAZARD OF HEARTS. Even when I was a thirteen-year old reading this classic story of a heroine whose father gambles her away to the hero, I knew it was a guilty pleasure. I had to guess how Barbara Cartland felt about her characters based on things I’d read about her and tried to be conservative on those questions. But even considering that, and the fact that she has no paranormal abilities (other than surviving with chronic breathlessness), Serena Staverley scored a respectable 53 points. As I suspected, an Uber-Sue.
Given Barbara Cartland’s undeniable popularity, there were–and probably still are–many romance readers who love a good Mary Sue. Maybe Mary Sue heroines are wish fulfillment for some readers as well as their authors?
As readers, when do you think an author crosses the line between creating an attractive character with problems in his/her past to creating a Mary Sue/Gary Stu? Do you enjoy reading the occasional romance with a Mary Sue?
And fellow writers, do let us know what happens if you try this test on your characters!
Elena
www.elenagreene.com
I dislike Mary Sue’s (no surprise there), esp when paired with a Gary Stu, as they almost always are . . . and then her purity heals him. *gack*
A long ago (and short term) critique partner had one of those too-perfect-for-this-world ingénue heroines and I kept pointing out how unbelievable/TSTL the girl’s behavior was until eventually I drove the poor writer into a rage. How could I not love her? She was pure and good and all things to be admired! She was sweetness and light! She was the ONLY kind of woman worth writing about. The only one who DESERVED the hero.
She made me want to retch.
Any tall, dark, and brooding hero worth his salt would have strangled her within a week.
There are Mary Sues and then there are THE Mary Sues. The first ones are merely, oh so sweet, oh so predictable, but the author makes them work because the hero pairing isn’t a Gary Stu. Now THE Mary Sues are the ones that cause continuous eye-rolls until the book becomes a wallbanger.
Ultimately, it is in the hands of the author. A talented author can make a Mary Sue work either by a different hero pairing, or by the circumstances and how they change her, etc.
It’s always the writing and the character growth arc.
And I have to admit that constant angsty angry brooding heroes are also annoying, because they become a type. Sometimes it is nice to read about nice funny people.
Wow! I was a little worried about my Atalanta — she has that name, of course, and is very good at some things — but she came out a very respectable 20. Whew! 🙂
As for what works — I think as a writer, it does help to think of your characters as real people. Even the people you love and respect most have flaws — so why shouldn’t your characters?
Though I suppose there are Mary Sue kinds of flaws, too! I recall once upon a time, it was terribly common for the heroines in historicals to be thought unattractive by other characters because they were “too thin.” I always thought that was sort of cheating — because of course (at the time) no reader thought there was such a thing as too thin! So the reader got her perfect heroine, and also an underdog outcast, at the same time…
Cara
OMG, that test is hilarious! Though I had no idea Darcy=dark, still, it went through every cliche in fiction.
I guess I’m going to have to dump the name Wil’low…too Mary Sue by half.
I’ve heard that Harriet Vane was Dorothy Sayers’ Mary Sue, and I’m pretty sure Emily of New Moon was LM Montgomery’s. I mean, Emily Byrd Starr is a Mary Sue name if ever was! Despite that, Harriet is one of my favorite characters, and I like Emily just fine, too. And one of my friends was APPALLED when I raved about Jacqueline Carey’s Kushiel books because Phedre is such a Mary Sue. I could see his point, but I don’t care. Still love the books.
I try to avoid obvious Mary Sue traits in my characters, but I do tend to give heroines the hair I wish I had (curly! and red or black instead of plain old brown).
I recall once upon a time, it was terribly common for the heroines in historicals to be thought unattractive by other characters because they were “too thin.” I always thought that was sort of cheating — because of course (at the time) no reader thought there was such a thing as too thin!
Oh, that’s SUCH a pet peeve of mine. “She was too slender for beauty, her eyes too large, her lips too full…” Yeah, RIGHT. (I did once have a heroine who thought her figure too buxom for fashion, but she realized that men appreciated it and didn’t go around bemoaning her breastalicious fate, just realized that certain styles looked better on her flatter-chested friend. Who, naturally, envied the buxom girl her curves, because the grass is always greener.)
What a great topic, Elena!
My heroine–Mary Smith–scored a 21, a borderline Sue. She’s pretty sassy, though, so I think she scored higher because she’s fairly no-nonsense. And I would like to be friends with her.
I’ve always loved that story and even enjoyed the “made for tv movie” of it. They left out the drug use, but otherwise, it was good.
Babs has made a career of writing about how the heroine’s pure love lifted them up to the Heavens and closer to God. Yeah, it can be pretty vomit-inducing but sometimes, I likes a sweetie.
In fanfics, Mary Sues are when the author puts themselves into the story. Like my Mary Sue where I become the Muggle Studies prof at Hogworts, and Dumbledore asks me to keep an eye on this big black dog… But really, we don’t need to go there. Suffice, he always managed to miss his vet appointments.
Ok, that test is a hoot. I did it a couple of times and none of my chacters score more than a 9.
Most of my characters score around 15 or 20, which might fit in with my liking for the moderate Mary Sues from my previous comment.
I come up with a 22, borderline Mary Sue, and I have no doubt that my heroine will feel like a “real” person, not a Mary Sue.
I always get the shivers with tests like this or even concepts like this. I immediately want to cite exceptions!
I truly believe the adage that the heroine of a romance should be a woman we would like to be (or would like to know) and the hero a man we could fall in love with. I think that would automatically score them high on the Mary Sue test.
I truly believe the adage that the heroine of a romance should be a woman we would like to be (or would like to know) and the hero a man we could fall in love with. I think that would automatically score them high on the Mary Sue test.
Yes, but I took those questions to mean was I unrealistically attached or attracted to my own creations. As in, was I like a certain NYT BS, who shall remain nameless, who said she buys Christmas gifts for her characters!
As in, was I like a certain NYT BS, who shall remain nameless, who said she buys Christmas gifts for her characters!
Oh. Well. If that is what you mean. I’ll admit to feeling like my characters are real people who might have lived in the Regency, but I’m pretty sure I know the difference between fantasy and reality!
Kalen, I found your CP story interesting because apparently one of the traits of “Suethors” is they are extremely defensive of their characters.
I think the 20-ish scores we’ve gotten so far for our heroines are genre-related. Most of us write heroines we’d like as friends and heroes we’d want to be with. They can still be well-rounded characters.
The truly annoying Mary Sues feel like puppets. It’s so obvious it is a form of author intrusion.
LOL on that too-thin heroine, Cara!
My pet peeve is the heroine who is so giving she never ever thinks of herself. Generosity is attractive; martyrdom, not so much. Yet some readers have criticized my heroines for being selfish. To each his own! I personally believe heroines who value themselves are better able to care for others.
Oh, man! Anti-Sues, I get Anti-Sues! This is supposed to be good on this test, but I AM trying to write romance after all. My characters should have SOME romantic traits. Yikes, I’m beginning to think I’m StarRaven, the last of a laser-eyed race of Contrarians from the planet Notgonnabepublishedinmylifetime.
Urgh.
Oh, loved the bit about Bono. My apologies to his fans, but he is a HUGE Mary Sue.
Now, Peter Gabriel on the other hand… 🙂
Georg, I admit to a sneaky desire to watch that movie. Maybe with some Cheetos and the right amount of wine.
LOL on the Muggle Studies prof. I wouldn’t mind taking care of that black dog either. 🙂
Oh, man! Anti-Sues, I get Anti-Sues! This is supposed to be good on this test, but I AM trying to write romance after all. My characters should have SOME romantic traits. Yikes, I’m beginning to think I’m StarRaven, the last of a laser-eyed race of Contrarians from the planet Notgonnabepublishedinmylifetime.
LOL, Jane! I’d guess your heroines are not running around kicking puppies so I wouldn’t sweat the test.
**LOL on the Muggle Studies prof. I wouldn’t mind taking care of that black dog either. :)**
Or minister to a certain tortured potions professor with a mellifluous voice…
Poor JK Rowling!
I’m thrilled to find out that the heroine of the book I just turned in, revisions done, hooray, scores a 9. And I deliberately didn’t mention her eye color once.